"And the rocket's red glare, the bombs bursting in air, gave proof through the night that our flag was still there."

Sometimes I wonder if the flag will still be there. Though I suppose an unfortunate percent of the country wouldn't mind. It's just a symbol of imperialistic oppression anyway.

"I can say—not as a patriotic bromide, but with full knowledge of the necessary metaphysical, epistemological, ethical, political and esthetic roots—that the United States of America is the greatest, the noblest and, in its original founding principles, the only moral country in the history of the world."

I believe this.


Looseyfur said...

I'm more of the type of person who thinks belief gets in the way of learning. Insert Lazarus Long tirade here.

I'm also pretty sure that most people in other countries aren't sitting at their tables sharing your belief. Saying, "Oh shit, I live in Australia. How much better would my life be if I lived in the greatest country on Earth -- the United States!"

And let's not talk about nobility. I'm going to think on it, but my gut says that there's nothing noble about capitalism.

It's not that I can't appreciate where we've been or where we might potentially go ... I'm just not sure that claiming a "place" in the world is necessary.

In fact, I think it comes off as arrogance rather than confidence. Mostly because there is actually no way to measure the traits that you used to define "greatest." Other than in you defining the qalifiers within your limited scope and experience. But I guess that's all belief is to me: emotional and intellectual limitations.

Does this make any sense?

I do realize that this is more of a in-person discussion.

Kyle said...

i'm pretty sure we are rome.

i think the key portion of your quote is, "in its original founding principles". principles that have long since fallen by the wayside.

i love this country. i love the freedom i have here. but you have to admit there are many problems here. problems that exist in other countries as well. but we can't say we are more moral or noble than all other nations. there are a variety of places where i could be happy living. places i would be happy living precisely because they are good places. good in every sense of the word. good enough, at least. i can't pretend that any country is perfect. or completely good or moral.

i suppose when it comes to the US, i'd say i'm going to side with batman. it has a lot of problems, but it's not beyond saving. i won't abandon it to the league of shadows.

i just needed to reference batman. july 18, bitches.

Michael said...

Is not belief required for learning? To learn something, don't you have to believe it. To disagree with a belief don't you have to believe something else is true?

Republic/Capitalism is indeed the only moral form of Government we've seen on Earth. However, from the beginning of our history, it has been tainted by those who profess to uphold it but do not believe it will work. Over the last 233 years, Industry and Government have together built a ghost system of commerce that hides behind the skin of capitalism. Trade, production, labor and natural resources have all fallen under the restriction of the Government. How is this capitalism? The goals of the current government are at odds with the goals of any decent entrepreneur. The entrepreneur is fighting with all his life to amass his own wealth as a result of his work and ideas, while the government is working around the clock to make sure that the profits of the able make it quickly into the hands of those in need. What a F'ed up system. And its been this way for a long time.
So i'm not sure we're better than anyone else, just younger. For now, I feel like we are cashing in the "Liberty" that someone else paid for, and it can't last long as such. Time to elect Dan supreme ruler for long enough to teach us all what the hell we're doing?